Otter Browser

Submit portable freeware that you find here. It helps if you include information like description, extraction instruction, Unicode support, whether it writes to the registry, and so on.
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Specular
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Re: Otter Browser

#16 Post by Specular » Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:22 am

Saw this comment after noticing the entry in the recent comments pane of the main site:
zorro wrote:Tested the stealth-status: not stealth following instructions.
Creates Registry-Key HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\KDE, at first start also a QT-Key and a Chromium-Key. The KDE-Key is persistent.
Mightn't be stealth then?

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webfork
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Re: Otter Browser

#17 Post by webfork » Mon Jan 15, 2018 2:31 pm

Could
Specular wrote:
Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:22 am
Mightn't be stealth then?
It might depend on the operating system (e.g. the key doesn't show up on the machine of the person who tested on Win7 but it might show up in Win10). Could you run the program and look for that regkey?

Specular
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Re: Otter Browser

#18 Post by Specular » Tue Jan 16, 2018 2:13 am

webfork wrote:
Mon Jan 15, 2018 2:31 pm
It might depend on the operating system (e.g. the key doesn't show up on the machine of the person who tested on Win7 but it might show up in Win10). Could you run the program and look for that regkey?
On W8.1 testing on a never-before installed system while sandboxed it didn't create those registry entries, tracking using RegFromApp. So could be something else maybe.

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Midas
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Re: Otter Browser

#19 Post by Midas » Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:23 am

Otter Browser (Pre) RC 5 released, dated 2018-02-01 (changelog at https://otter-browser.org/).

Windows binaries available from sf.net /projects/otter-browser/files/otter-browser-rc5/.

Portability addressed at github.com /OtterBrowser/otter-browser/blob/master/INSTALL.md.

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smaragdus
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Re: Otter 0.9.99 RC 9

#20 Post by smaragdus » Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:13 pm

I was forced to downvote the database entry because of the new disgusting icon set, screens:

Image

Image

I cannot tolerate such atrocious ugliness. If the developers choose to add an option to restore the old icons in the future I may upvote Otter again. If they insist on delivering only the current obnoxious icon set without and option to switch back to the previous icon set (Oxygen icon set is not nice but tolerable) I will dump Otter for good.

More about the new disgusting look.

Specular
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Re: Otter 0.9.99 RC 9

#21 Post by Specular » Fri Jun 22, 2018 1:54 am

smaragdus wrote:
Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:13 pm
I was forced to downvote the database entry because of the new disgusting icon set.

If they insist on delivering only the current obnoxious icon set without and option to switch back to the previous icon set (Oxygen icon set is not nice but tolerable) I will dump Otter for good.

More about the new disgusting look.
They mention in that thread how to use the previous icons if desired, so it doesn't seem like a huge issue tbh. Also it's pretty much a one-man team working on Otter browser, we're blessed it even exists as a passion project, so constructive criticism seems like a more appropriate reaction.

The thing is that unless an icon designer steps forward to volunteer or they find an existing icon set with a compatible license that suits everyone then you end up with so-so icons like Vivaldi does (though in their case they have the resources to pay someone which makes it baffling). Personally I'm fond of Opera 12's icon set, and Chrome's (prior to the Windows 10-style theme update), which are inoffensive and well designed.

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Re: Otter

#22 Post by smaragdus » Tue Jun 26, 2018 11:25 am

@Specular
They mention in that thread how to use the previous icons if desired, so it doesn't seem like a huge issue tbh. Also it's pretty much a one-man team working on Otter browser, we're blessed it even exists as a passion project, so constructive criticism seems like a more appropriate reaction.

The thing is that unless an icon designer steps forward to volunteer or they find an existing icon set with a compatible license that suits everyone then you end up with so-so icons like Vivaldi does (though in their case they have the resources to pay someone which makes it baffling). Personally I'm fond of Opera 12's icon set, and Chrome's (prior to the Windows 10-style theme update), which are inoffensive and well designed.
I usually do not respond to people using the "constructive criticism" cliche but I will reply since I have communicated with you for quite some time.

I hate all kinds of censorship including self-censorship. I always express my opinion the way I like to express it. Once I tested Otter version 0.9.12 Beta 12, I found it promising and that was why I added it to the database. Recently I tested version 0.9.99 RC 9, I detested its new looks and I downvoted it, that is all. I have spent many years hacking and tweaking software, I have neither time nor will to try to restore features which were once present but now are officially unavailable. I am especially sensitive when a browser is ruined because I am running out of browsers- I am struggling with terribly outdated but heavily equipped version of Firefox since I simply cannot switch to Chromium-based browsers wholeheartedly. When I first saw the new too-bar icons used by latest version Otter I was terrified- I have never seen so ugly a browser- uglier than Chrome, Chromopera, Chomefox and any other browser I have ever used or tested. The horrible new icon set has not made its way to Otter by itself, obviously the developer approved it. So if the developer does not provide official support for other icon sets or an option to restore the old icon set I am done with Otter. Even if the developer spends billions of hour coding Otter it does not matter to me- it is his decision, his free will. For me it was triste to see another open source developer succumbing to modern ugliness and thus ruining a promising project.

Specular
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Re: Otter

#23 Post by Specular » Wed Jun 27, 2018 2:31 am

smaragdus wrote:
Tue Jun 26, 2018 11:25 am
I usually do not respond to people using the "constructive criticism" cliche but I will reply since I have communicated with you for quite some time.

I hate all kinds of censorship including self-censorship. I always express my opinion the way I like to express it.
I can totally understand frustrations when software drops something that was previously liked/loved. Opera 12 is possibly one of the biggest blows in that regard. Thankfully we have devs who are interested in alternatives, and I'm glad for it.

I mean, if you find that manner of criticism effective at reaching the desired results when dealing with freeware devs then I suppose one would be more inclined to voice things that way. I just haven't seen it be effective compared to constructive criticism, which is simply about being able to detail the problem and suggest practical solutions (critique that's 'actionable' is a good definition for it). It's not about censoring things one is passionate about.

Like in this instance the Otter dev apparently had various users criticize the previous icon set as being outdated, and so they updated it. Some had real problems with it, such as yourself, but notice no one described why they didn't like it and how it could be improved, rather posting it's 'disgusting', 'obnoxious', and 'ugly'. Now picture the primary dev, who isn't a visual designer, reading feedback where both the old (check the Github issues) and new have been described as 'ugly' (which tbf is probably true), but without posting what could be changed and how, or even examples of what they prefer or like.

Opera 12's icon set, which I believe you've mentioned you like (as I do too), could similarly be described as flat, monotone, and straightforward, yet I've seen some of those descriptors also leveled as criticisms of Otter's new icon set (personally I could detail what some of its flaws are but I'm just speaking of those who've critiqued it so far). Without more clear discussion of what works and doesn't I could see it being hard for the dev to please everyone since the feedback is so barebones. Luckily the browser has a setting to change the icon set, so it's a bit of a non-issue.

Also unlike large companies/organizations like Mozilla, Opera and Google, a benefit of freeware/open source is devs are usually far likelier to listen to smaller user requests and implement changes, so it's not like one is shouting into the void in any hopeless pursuit of change. The flip side is since they're often just individuals they can also lose motivation with passion projects, unlike large companies which aren't affected by this, which is something I keep in mind with interactions.

I've had many features and changes implemented in freeware/open source programs I use regularly simply by detailing it well, describing the benefits over the existing implementation, and being polite. Just recently a dev implemented a significant change to their software based on my proposal which for years had gone pretty much ignored, in large part I'd say since it seems no one previously had outlined it well.

Just my thoughts on it.
So if the developer does not provide official support for other icon sets or an option to restore the old icon set I am done with Otter.
Just in case it was missed, a user posted both the browser setting that allows the icon set to be changed, and the icon set itself, in the 5th post of that DnD Sanctuary topic you posted, prior to your posts.

freakazoid
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Re: Otter Browser

#24 Post by freakazoid » Sat Jul 07, 2018 10:31 am

If the main reason for ditching a browser is because of the icon set, then that's not a valid reason at all.

SeaMonkey and K-Meleon looks like ass by default, but can be styled to look better.
is it stealth? ;)

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