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 Post subject: X-Datacrow addition
PostPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2011 1:23 pm 
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[Moderator note: this thread was split from the thread Switching X-Inkscape to Inkspace Portable hosted by Inkscape after a question by Danix.]

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Danix wrote:
Sometime ago I tried to add an entry, X-DataCrow, (entry - forum post), but evidently nobody likes this program (or wpp programs maybe? :) ), as no R5 user voted for it, so it has still the "private" status.

DataCrow is 'natively' portable with the -dir parameter and already has an entry in PFC that predates this duplicate entry by nearly a year. It can be launched from any portable JRE (including our own jPortable) with
Code:
java.exe -Xmx256m -jar PATHTO\datacrow.jar -dir:PATHTODATADIR
according to the post. Paths won't be portablized and things may be left behind, of course, but that is not required for 'native' portability. It doesn't have enough votes yet: http://www.portablefreeware.com/index.php?id=1865

Oddly, it seems you were aware of the original post as you commented on it before creating your duplicate entry. So, the duplicate entry should not have been created.

X-DataCrow can be listed as an alternative in that listing and the duplicate X-DataCrow entry removed. If you wish, you can petition to have X-DataCrow become the primary listing as it is easier to setup, but these are generally only done if major functionality is broken in the app (see VLC's media library) or the setup procedure is very complicated (see Pidgin). My personal opinion is to prefer the more-portable, easier-to-use option, even if it may result in a duplicate JRE install, but that is not the overall preference of PFC in my understanding. In the future, before creating a new listing, you can search to see if it was already submitted using the information right at the top of the create page:
Quote:
Reminder: Before you submit, please check if other members have already submitted the same application by typing "[@] appname" in the search box.

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 Post subject: Re: Switching X-Inkscape to Inkspace Portable hosted by Inks
PostPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2011 1:42 pm 
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Quote:
Reminder: Before you submit, please check if other members have already submitted the same application by typing "[@] appname" in the search box.

I'm sorry for that. I did not do a search with that option.
But, now I saw that strangely.. I commented the entry on 2011-04-08 :shock:
Maybe I forgotten..It has been public or has always been private?

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 Post subject: Re: Switching X-Inkscape to Inkspace Portable hosted by Inks
PostPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2011 10:19 pm 
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Danix wrote:
Quote:
Reminder: Before you submit, please check if other members have already submitted the same application by typing "[@] appname" in the search box.

I'm sorry for that. I did not do a search with that option.
But, now I saw that strangely.. I commented the entry on 2011-04-08 :shock:
Maybe I forgotten..It has been public or has always been private?


Because votes aren't logged, I'm not sure. I think it has always been private.

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 Post subject: Re: Switching X-Inkscape to Inkspace Portable hosted by Inks
PostPosted: Fri Aug 26, 2011 12:45 am 
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SYSTEM wrote:
CUT
Because votes aren't logged, I'm not sure. I think it has always been private.


Hi SISTEM,
I'm pretty sure I voted it while I was logged (Yes I know I'm R0, but I was logged, there is also mine comment!).
After a quick check, actually I can see:

X-Datacrow (submitted on 2011-06-15)
the score is 55

Data Crow - Wolfghost's submission (2010-07-20)
the score is 26
http://www.portablefreeware.com/index.php?q=[%40]data+crow&m=Search
(please copy/paste whole string!)


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 Post subject: Re: Switching X-Inkscape to Inkspace Portable hosted by Inks
PostPosted: Fri Aug 26, 2011 1:30 am 
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rikylov wrote:
SYSTEM wrote:
CUT
Because votes aren't logged, I'm not sure. I think it has always been private.


Hi SISTEM,
I'm pretty sure I voted it while I was logged (Yes I know I'm R0, but I was logged, there is also mine comment!).
After a quick check, actually I can see:

X-Datacrow (submitted on 2011-06-15)
the score is 55

Data Crow - Wolfghost's submission (2010-07-20)
the score is 26
http://www.portablefreeware.com/index.php?q=[%40]data+crow&m=Search
(please copy/paste whole string!)


They are public scores, which only depend on traffic. They are very low being public scores.

Whether an entry is public depends on the internal score that depends on votes and is visible only if you're logged in.

X-Datacrow has an internal score of 0 and Data Crow 5. The threshold of being public is 10.

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 Post subject: Re: Switching X-Inkscape to Inkspace Portable hosted by Inks
PostPosted: Fri Aug 26, 2011 5:01 am 
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SYSTEM wrote:
They are public scores, which only depend on traffic. They are very low being public scores.

Whether an entry is public depends on the internal score that depends on votes and is visible only if you're logged in.

X-Datacrow has an internal score of 0 and Data Crow 5. The threshold of being public is 10.


Hi all,
I'm Taf (a member of wPP team).
One question to SYSTEM:
I read your answer to Rikylov, but something is not clear to me.
Actually I'm logged (obviously) but I'm not able neither to see internal score nor to find Danix submission using the "search" option with words "datacrow"
Moreover, if I try to search with words "x-datacrow" I've NO results at all!
why this happens?
Is it my fault or TPFC's?

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 Post subject: X-Datacrow addition
PostPosted: Fri Aug 26, 2011 5:58 am 
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Taf wrote:
Actually I'm logged (obviously) but I'm not able neither to see internal score nor to find Danix submission using the "search" option with words "datacrow"
Moreover, if I try to search with words "x-datacrow" I've NO results at all!
why this happens?
Is it my fault or TPFC's?

Internal score is only visible to members of a certain rating. Searching non-public results requires add [@] to the beginning of your search query. When you're going to add a new entry, it says this on the entry page and everyone capable of adding a new entry can see both the listing and the score.

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 Post subject: Re: Switching X-Inkscape to Inkspace Portable hosted by Inks
PostPosted: Fri Aug 26, 2011 7:37 am 
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JohnTHaller wrote:
Taf wrote:
Actually I'm logged (obviously) but I'm not able neither to see internal score nor to find Danix submission using the "search" option with words "datacrow"
Moreover, if I try to search with words "x-datacrow" I've NO results at all!
why this happens?
Is it my fault or TPFC's?

Internal score is only visible to members of a certain rating. Searching non-public results requires add [@] to the beginning of your search query. When you're going to add a new entry, it says this on the entry page and everyone capable of adding a new entry can see both the listing and the score.


Many Thank John for your feedback (quicker than SYSTEM :) )! now this part is a bit more clear by my side.
Anyway, do you (all) know why if I try to search with words "x-datacrow" (without [@]) I've NO results at all! Otherwise if I search with words "datacrow" (without spaces) I can see under "Forum topics matching your query" --> the "data crow" (with one space) submission (in the forum) but not the submission of x-datacrow?
I try my personal answer: because "data crow" words are in the subject of Wolfghost post and X-datacrow submission reference lies inside this post, without a specific Subject (is it true?)

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 Post subject: Re: X-Datacrow addition
PostPosted: Fri Aug 26, 2011 11:00 am 
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Danix wrote:
SYSTEM wrote:
Feel free to continue link suggestions in the future, especially if the WPP version has advantages over the main entry.
Sometime ago I tried to add an entry, X-DataCrow, (entry - forum post), but evidently nobody likes this program (or wpp programs maybe? :) ), as no R5 user voted for it, so it has still the "private" status.

As with LibreOffice, I'd like JavaGet to be tested for portability, but this forum has (in the past) been disinterested in Java software. That might have something to do with why it hasn't gone live.

JohnTHaller wrote:
DataCrow is 'natively' portable with the -dir parameter and already has an entry in PFC that predates this duplicate entry by nearly a year. It can be launched from any portable JRE (including our own jPortable) with
Code:
java.exe -Xmx256m -jar PATHTO\datacrow.jar -dir:PATHTODATADIR
according to the post. Paths won't be portablized and things may be left behind, of course, but that is not required for 'native' portability.

Cool -- good to know. That's probably how I'd run it if I used this program.

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Last edited by webfork on Fri Aug 26, 2011 11:04 am, edited 3 times in total.
(bad url tag, added response to JohnTHaller's comment)


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 Post subject: Re: X-Datacrow addition
PostPosted: Sat Aug 27, 2011 4:21 am 
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webfork wrote:
As with LibreOffice, I'd like JavaGet to be tested for portability, but this forum has (in the past) been disinterested in Java software. That might have something to do with why it hasn't gone live.

Hi webfork,
we can confirm that winPenPack JavaGet utility is fully portable and stealth. Obviously, we will agreed if someone in your staff will test it and report the results.

At this page you can find more technical details on how it works.

Best regards
zandet2

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 Post subject: Re: X-Datacrow addition
PostPosted: Sat Aug 27, 2011 6:40 am 
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JohnTHaller wrote:
Internal score is only visible to members of a certain rating.


Oh, I had forgotten that. Thanks John.

Taf wrote:
Anyway, do you (all) know why if I try to search with words "x-datacrow" (without [@]) I've NO results at all!


A forum search gives exactly the same result. Blame phpBB developers, not us. ;)

Taf wrote:
Otherwise if I search with words "datacrow" (without spaces) I can see under "Forum topics matching your query" --> the "data crow" (with one space) submission (in the forum) but not the submission of x-datacrow?


Danix didn't create a separate thread for X-Datacrow. He posted to the Data Crow thread.

webfork wrote:
JohnTHaller wrote:
DataCrow is 'natively' portable with the -dir parameter and already has an entry in PFC that predates this duplicate entry by nearly a year. It can be launched from any portable JRE (including our own jPortable) with
Code:
java.exe -Xmx256m -jar PATHTO\datacrow.jar -dir:PATHTODATADIR
according to the post. Paths won't be portablized and things may be left behind, of course, but that is not required for 'native' portability.

Cool -- good to know. That's probably how I'd run it if I used this program.


John probably got the command line from the Data Crow entry.

FYI, the -Xmx256m switch allows the program to allocate up to 256 megabytes of memory. By default, Java Virtual Machine limits memory usage to 64 megabytes.

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 Post subject: Re: X-Datacrow addition
PostPosted: Tue Aug 30, 2011 8:58 am 
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zandet2 wrote:
webfork wrote:
As with LibreOffice, I'd like JavaGet to be tested for portability, but this forum has (in the past) been disinterested in Java software. That might have something to do with why it hasn't gone live.

Obviously, we will agreed if someone in your staff will test it and report the results.


Two things here:

  • While I'm hoping someone will decide to test it, that's totally voluntary. I would do it myself, but I don't really have the system setup to handle that and any test I do is just partial.
  • Just to clarify, when I use JavaGet, its going to download to a local shared folder. So for example if I want to use X-LibreOffice, X-Datacrow, and perhaps another program that uses JavaGet, I'm not going to have 3 copies of it. The link you pointed to seems to say that, but just to be 100%.

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 Post subject: Re: X-Datacrow addition
PostPosted: Tue Aug 30, 2011 11:46 am 
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webfork wrote:
Two things here:

  • While I'm hoping someone will decide to test it, that's totally voluntary. I would do it myself, but I don't really have the system setup to handle that and any test I do is just partial.

Hi webfork,
it's the same here in winPenPack, everyone do everything totally voluntary...
And, as can you imagine, due to a little "conflict of interest" is better if someone else will confirm what I'm saying 8)

Quote:
  • Just to clarify, when I use JavaGet, its going to download to a local shared folder. So for example if I want to use X-LibreOffice, X-Datacrow, and perhaps another program that uses JavaGet, I'm not going to have 3 copies of it. The link you pointed to seems to say that, but just to be 100%.

You are right:
if Java is missing, the JavaGet utility download and put Java inside a winPenPack structure, in the Lib\Java subfolder; all the X-Programs placed under the same structure (usually under a winPenPack menu) will share that Java binaries.

best regards
zandet2

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 Post subject: Re: X-Datacrow addition
PostPosted: Tue Aug 30, 2011 1:48 pm 
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zandet2 wrote:
if Java is missing, the JavaGet utility download and put Java inside a winPenPack structure, in the Lib\Java subfolder; all the X-Programs placed under the same structure (usually under a winPenPack menu) will share that Java binaries.


I believe he means solo, without the WPP menu which most people at PFC do not use (and will not likely use due to it switching to .NET). Will it still use a shared location then?

Like with jPortable at PortableApps.com. It uses a shared location that is utilized by LibreOffice Portable, the jPortable Launcher (which allows you to run most JAR apps portably without modification) and all our Java-based portable apps we have out as test releases. It's also got Oracle sign-off on the naming and logo so it doesn't infringe on the Java registered trademark.

And I think webfork meant that testing it was voluntary not whether WPP was voluntary. I would think it is like PortableApps.com.

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 Post subject: Re: X-Datacrow addition
PostPosted: Tue Aug 30, 2011 2:03 pm 
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zandet2 wrote:
all the X-Programs placed under the same structure (usually under a winPenPack menu) will share that Java binaries.

Sounds good -- thanks for clearing that up.

Edit: I misread this post by JohnTHaller the first time:
JohnTHaller wrote:
I believe he means solo, without the WPP menu which most people at PFC do not use (and will not likely use due to it switching to .NET). Will it still use a shared location then?

I interpreted his post that, yes, it works independent of a launcher program, but a confirmation on that would be helpful.

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