FileVoyager - file manager

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webfork
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Re: FileVoyager (file manager)

#16 Post by webfork »

Impressive program. I played with it for about an hour tonight and put together a few notes:
  • I wouldn't include the translation PDF in the distribution - only a very small percentage of users will use that. I'd just put a web link or something similar. At minimum run it through FileOptimizer at 150 dpi as it cuts down on file size by 37%
  • I'd switch latest author posts over to just a website/dev blog button. It's a cool idea but it takes up a lot of screen real estate and I found it a little distracting. Might move it into the preference menu or make it otherwise optional.
  • Several things default to french ... Default Favorites (English language Windows, click Favorites Manager, the window has Bibliotheques instead of Library, Musique rather than Music) hovering the mouse over drop items (skype, teamviewer, etc.)
  • Initial launch errors - I think the program by default tries to autostart in Program Files (x86), which doesn't exist on my system so I got two pop-ups saying the folder didn't exist.
  • Presumably the program would be more portable if the default links worked with portable TeamViewer / Portable Skype. This is a hard problem that I'm not sure I know how to solve.
Good stuff
  • Themes were sharp
  • Really liked the visualization tools. It reminds me of SE-Explorer but much more mature.

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smaragdus
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Re: FileVoyager (file manager)

#17 Post by smaragdus »

@FileVoyager
Thanks for the release of truly portable version of FileVoyager (16.1.29.0). However I experience crashes
screen-shot-
FileVoyager 16.1.29.0 - crash - 001 - 2016-01-30.png
FileVoyager 16.1.29.0 - crash - 001 - 2016-01-30.png (7.75 KiB) Viewed 61904 times
when I right-click on title bar (my system- Windows 8 x64).

More, I think that the Application Bar should be empty by default because it shows programs that are not available. I would also suggest a possibility to re-arrange the icons in the Application Bar via drag&drop (if it is not too hard to be implemented.

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Re: FileVoyager (file manager)

#18 Post by FileVoyager »

Hello guys!
A lot of feedback, I love that!

@webfork
  • About the PDF : I received a lot of positive testimonials about that. So I would like to keep it in the distribution. But indeed, I could UPX it (or FileOptimize it)
  • The Author's post : There is now an option in Preferences\General page that allows you to switch it off. As of 16.1.29, it's a checkbox at the bottom
  • Things that default to French : By error I've put my own ini files in the 7z packages. Normally, Portable FV comes with \Ini\Portable.ini only. I've corrected the downloadable packages. In your case, if you want to clean it up, close FV and delete all the ini's except portable.ini
  • Initial start up errors : That's linked to the above mistake. When it restarts, it try to reopen the folder I was in when I closed it. It doesn't find it and acknowledges you. Initial startup of clean versions are Desktop on one side, and MyComputer on the other.
  • Application Bar portable links : I often think about it. I will continue to think about how to efficiently link portable apps. It will probably use relative paths...TBC
@smaragdus
  • Crash : Not easy...I haven't been able to reproduce it...Does it systematically crash when you right-click the title bar?
  • Ghost programs in Application Bar : It's because of a packaging mistake I did (see my response here above to webfork, at "Things that default to French")
  • Application Bar - rearrange via drag&drop : must be feasible. Just give me time...
It's a pleasure to discuss with you guys!

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Midas
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Re: FileVoyager (file manager)

#19 Post by Midas »

Hi. FileVoyager v16.1.29.0 retested (changelog at http://www.filevoyager.com/doc/changelog/).

I can confirm it is currently fully portable and mostly stealth.

It creates a folder 'FVTemp' in '%TEMP%' that isn't removed on exit, but that is considered acceptable by TPFC rules.

Apart that, all settings are kept in the 'Ini' sub-folder at program location. Nevertheless, the 'Portable.ini' present there includes a 'url' key by default with a 'http://www.filevoyager.com/thank-you-fo ... levoyager/' value and will trigger a browser launch to that URL on first start. This can be prevented by erasing the file contents, which in fairness FileVoyager does afterwards.

Also, the 'GetNewsRSS' key in the 'AutoUpdate' section of 'FileVoyager.ini' defaults to '1' which will retrieve online news until deactivated, either through "Preferences" (see below) or by setting it to '0' in 'FileVoyager.ini'.

Further findings and suggestions:

- I oppened "Preferences", switched away to my text editor, and when I came back only FileVoyager main windows was displayed and I couldn't interect with it -- I had to call Task Manager to kill it.
- With "Display grid lines in pane lists" unchecked in "File exploration" options tab, gridlines still display in "Disk properties", for instance (see below).
- While visually attractive, the "ThumbFlow" control at the top of the left pane by default serves little purpose -- it can't be clicked and can only be hidden by clicking an unremarkable seven dot separator (it can be permanently disabled through 'FileVoyager.ini').
- Using the traditional menu layout can be activated through 'FileVoyager.ini' ('ShowOldToolbars=1'), but there's a "Switch to Ribbon" button always present, but once you click it I couldn't find an option to switch back.
- An alternative toolbar (preferable with a toggle to display toolbar text) would be a welcome addition, instead of the space wasting ribbon (see below) with its alternating horizontal and vertical button disposition.
- An option to display panes stacked instead of the classic side by side (horizontal split) would also be welcome.
- If the "Central Toolbar" is closed by clicking on the top right 'x' button, that action isn't reflected by the "Common Toolbars" control in the ribbon.
- "Visualization" tabs also look cluttered at first sight, they'd probably benefit from a switch to a vertical layout.
- I would appreciate an option to switch from 'breadcrumbs' to plain paths atop the file panes.

Image

Image

Image


And here's the look after tweaking FileVoyager to my liking:

Image

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Re: FileVoyager (file manager)

#20 Post by FileVoyager »

Hi Midas,

Thank you for your "inspection" :D
About your findings and suggestions:
  • The invisible Preferences window : I've been unable to reproduce it. When I do the same actions, the form appears above FV (under Win10 & Win7).
  • The grid lines : Well, this option was just meant for the file lists. But OK, it can be expanded to the other "Grid" lists.
  • The ThumbFlow not clickable : Not yet clickable, that's true. The code for clicking is already written, but stops working after a few click. I deactivate it until I resolve the issue.
  • Hiding the Thumbflow : The seven dots you describe are just the splitter that permits resizing. To hide the ThumbFlow, just select another display mode (Report, large report, icon, list, Thumbnails are the other five view). In your screenshot, FV has been resized in such a way that the Flow takes all the pane space.
  • Space wasting Ribbon : You can collapse the Ribbon with the small arrow (top right) next to the help icon. Good catch for the classic menu. But it will not be maintained anymore.
  • Classic menu or toolbar, plain path instead of crumbbar : That would be so...90's
I also noted the rest of the suggestions.
Thanks!

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Re: FileVoyager (file manager)

#21 Post by billon »

Version 16.2.20.0 released

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tactictoe
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Re: FileVoyager (file manager)

#22 Post by tactictoe »

Now we are talking... love this software more and more. If you ever need my vote you have it.
No link in the TPFC database?

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smaragdus
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Re: FileVoyager (file manager)

#23 Post by smaragdus »

Classic menu or toolbar, plain path instead of crumbbar : That would be so...90's
Ribbon is abomination- ugly, waste of space, waste of time (I don't want to be a clicking monkey as is the motto of a popular download manager). It is a shame that so many developers adopted this Microsoft obscenity. Nowadays modernity means ugliness, dullness, lack of options, lack of customization, mediocrity. I bet the developer of FileVoyager has never used a program from 90's but is ignorant and vulgar enough to use flat sarcasm. I cannot tolerate such attitude so I will not test FileVoyager any longer, no matter that I have prepared a preliminary list of enhancements and features.

By the way the most famous commercial file managers- Total Commander, EF Commander, XYplorer, SpeedCommander, WinNc, AB Commander, Altap Salamander, System Navigator don't offer the obnoxious ribbon, while in xplorer it is optional.

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Re: FileVoyager (file manager)

#24 Post by FileVoyager »

smaragdus wrote:I bet the developer of FileVoyager has never used a program from 90's but is ignorant and vulgar enough to use flat sarcasm. I cannot tolerate such attitude so I will not test FileVoyager any longer, no matter that I have prepared a preliminary list of enhancements and features.

Sorry if my statement irritate you...It was not meant to be sarcastic at all.

I wrote my first lines of code in 1990 on an Commodore Amiga 500. I was 15.
The "Ribbon vs Menu" debate is a discussion about aesthetic. It's fully subjective and, as such, a neverending discussion.
I receive enough of testimonials to believe that the Ribbon UI satisfies many people.
smaragdus wrote:Ribbon is abomination- ugly, waste of space

The Ribbon can be collapsed by clicking the small arrow on the right, reducing it to a small row of tabs.
smaragdus wrote:no matter that I have prepared a preliminary list of enhancements and features
Please share your list. I'm sure it will be plenty of common sense and it will mainly be a benefit for the user's community, not for me.
So don't punish them because I said something the wrong way.

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Re: FileVoyager (file manager)

#25 Post by Midas »

FileVoyager wrote:The "Ribbon vs Menu" debate is a discussion about aesthetic. It's fully subjective and, as such, a neverending discussion.
I receive enough of testimonials to believe that the Ribbon UI satisfies many people.
  • I beg to differ: it is also a matter of usability, as are all UI/UX issues. For one and as I pointed out, it lacks consistency in spacial arrangement...
FileVoyager wrote:The Ribbon can be collapsed by clicking the small arrow on the right, reducing it to a small row of tabs.
  • In which case you have no visible toolbar and an extra click layer to access any of its functions.

    I am willing to bet that the majority of the Ribbon's advocates are using higher resolution or touch enabled screens, in vivid contrast to its attacker's field where I count myself.
FileVoyager wrote:Please share your list. I'm sure it will be plenty of common sense and it will mainly be a benefit for the user's community, not for me. So don't punish them because I said something the wrong way.
  • I agree. I plead you reconsider, dear smaragdus. If the work is done already, anyway, please bestow the sweat of your brow on the community's higher interest.

    Going back to a previous remark:
FileVoyager wrote:In your screenshot, FV has been resized in such a way that the Flow takes all the pane space.
  • The screenshots I posted were taken in exactly the same computer environment, my faithful Thinkpad X220 whose default resolution is a scant (by today's standards) 1366x768... That particular FV screencap was made with the default layout at first start resized to a workable dimension. Please note how my preferred layout is even more compact while still offering much functionality.

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Re: FileVoyager (file manager)

#26 Post by webfork »

@FileVoyager:

While I don’t have the evidently very strong anti-ribbon feelings that other members of the forum have, we are a forum that tends toward tweaking and customization so it's likely we approach software differently than most users. Few ribbon interfaces allow for much customization, making those interfaces less attractive to our users. It's one place where for example LibreOffice annihilates Microsoft Office 2010.

Also, please don’t feel put off on posting here because some folks have strong opinions. Just in terms of engagement, you’re already well ahead of most of the developers I’ve interacted with through my work on this site.
Last edited by webfork on Mon Feb 22, 2016 1:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: (radical edit; much better wording)

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Re: FileVoyager (file manager)

#27 Post by smaragdus »

@FileVoyager
Sorry if my statement irritate you...It was not meant to be sarcastic at all.

I wrote my first lines of code in 1990 on an Commodore Amiga 500. I was 15.
I was rude. I apologize. I am no trying to defend my harshness- just an explanation- I am not a programmer and my profession has nothing to do with software, testing programs has always been just a hobby for me in my spare time. Lately the universal trend of dumbing down everything (browsers, chat programs, download managers, etc) makes me so frustrated that I am considering just to switch to Linux permanently. I didn't intend to be offensive- I just supposed (wrongly) that you are one of those new generation programmers who despise everything older than Windows 10. In fact I saw that FileVoyager has a potential long before it appeared here in the forum and even contacted you via mail (and as far as I remember I even suggested crowd-funding, which, unfortunately, didn't work). So I don't have anything against you or your project.

FileVoyager is your project and you decide what features it will include and what it will not. My opinion- the more customization options a program offers the better since thus it may be appealing and useful to a larger audience.

About Ribbons- I really do not see any advantages but only disadvantages. And yes, I know it can be hidden. I am not requiring anything- I would like just to ask- would the creation of a normal standard tool-bar require too much programming effort?

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Re: FileVoyager (file manager)

#28 Post by tactictoe »

I beg to differ: it is also a matter of usability, as are all UI/UX issues. For one and as I pointed out, it lacks consistency in spacial arrangement...
Agreed 100%. Am I against the Ribbon? Not really, it has its usage especially if you want a rigid UI imposed to the end user.
About Ribbons- I really do not see any advantages but only disadvantages. And yes, I know it can be hidden. I am not requiring anything- I would like just to ask- would the creation of a normal standard tool-bar require too much programming effort?
Bold part: Agreed.

I can answer that one as a developer:

You will need to relocate the code to button, combobox and other related various component.
Effort not really, classic GUI with toolbar need less properties settings then it's just code but more time to analysis (what most of dev lack these days, sigh).
Time consumption is what is required.
Lots of copy/paste of procedure and routine; some inevitable routine adjustment here and there, so no real big effort. Plain boring re-adaptation of code no dev likes, or may be some but I don't want to talk about them. Lost of time, which in turn feels a little bit like a setback if you like so much your UI. Please note I said lost of time not waste of time. :wink:

For young dev non-corrupted by MS, here is a thought.
Tempted to put a ribbon from your VCL on a form but want the flexibility of the classic toolbar?
Place a page control on a panel, define as many tabsheet as needed then add toolbar and control as many as you like.
Looks like a ribbon, isn't it? Sure is. BUT can be relocated at runtime and all the advantage of toolbar of course. Simulated ribbon rigidity: NONE, flexibility design and runtime: maximum, customisation with or without third party component: yes. A little bit of effort at the start but great reward at the end. Feel like on steroid? All the above could be the base of a new component, a revisited ribbon that got it right this time. Not just a pretty face component. Want to even do better? Use your imagination, key to your success and may be the birth of a revolutionary UI. But this is just my thought.
If it's just to look like MS product 100%, because you must... well drop the ribbon component on your form (your funeral) but do not complain of it lacks of flexibility after user feedback later on the track or just being told by some of your dev peer you have no imagination. But this is MHO only.

Edited:
Lately the universal trend of dumbing down everything...
IMHO it started with XP and it's wizard, no more deep manual settings like in 2000 but wizard, windows 8 bring the flat OS looks and feels (because of the tablet market?) and goodbye desktop at startup, windows 10 brings the colour down... Also from XP to 10: all settings increase in difficulties of access. More and more unknow behind each OS. EULA with less right and more intriguing/disgusting clause. Oh well, what goes around turn around. No wonder why you feel like going to a Unix type like system. I do too. Sad it will have to come to that later on the track for me, I guess. May be it will be even a deliverance. Cynically I might even sing this Abba hit: Money money money in a Richredmond's world... but I won't ...don't want to add more to climate change.

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Re: FileVoyager (file manager)

#29 Post by smaragdus »

@tactictoe

Thanks for your insightful post.

I am on Windows 8 and I think this will be my last Windows version. I managed to make Windows 8 tolerable via Classic Shell, removing its most disgusting features (start screen, hot corners, task-bar transparency, etc). I have also gotten rid of all these so called apps (I have never seem something as crappier as these apps). But I will never "upgrade" to beta-quality (at best) privacy disaster Windows 10. Cortana, Edge, ugliness at its best, forced updates, spying (nowadays it is modern to call spying telemetry, but I hate euphemisms), no, thanks. My problem is that I have almost no experience in Linux and don't have so much time and enthusiasm to start to learn almost from scratch. I will also have to transfer a lot of data stored in Windows only programs and more- many of my favourite programs don't run on Linux. So I postpone my migration to Linux until it will be inevitable.

I think that the dumbing down of software is best visible in browsers- just remember what Opera and Firefox once were and have a look at what are they now- just spectres of the apparitions of the ghosts of the once great browsers. I refuse to install heaps of add-ons just to restore functionality once available by default. I will continue to use my archaic version of Firefox until it is possible and then I will have to switch either to Pale Moon or to SeaMonkey. For me Chrome is a bigger curse for the Internet than Internet Explorer was once.

About the ribbon interface- once I tried to get accustomed to it using another program containing the word Voyager in its name- FTP Voyager, but I could not overcome my aversion and disgust to ugliness and unhandiness.

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Re: FileVoyager (file manager)

#30 Post by tactictoe »

@smaragdus
I am on Windows 8 and I think this will be my last Windows version. I managed to make Windows 8 tolerable via Classic Shell, removing its most disgusting features (start screen, hot corners, task-bar transparency, etc). I have also gotten rid of all these so called apps (I have never seem something as crappier as these apps).
EXACTLY the same here. Classic shell is great, Apps? GONE. Rest is tweak here and there like you did. Windows 10? Until it stop to be a spy, no way I will migrate there. As you do, I am looking to migrate to something else. Keeping a PC under windows only for development. I look to Mac OS and Unix system but did not make a choice for now. React OS is good but it is not yet mature, sigh. Oh well, will see what the future will bring... only the best.

Sometime when I develop software for the community I am so tempt to put a compiler clause for the software to NOT work under windows 10 :twisted: :evil: But no, the community has nothing to do with the agenda of Redmond's people. Anyway, it is not the way to act and just utopia's thoughts

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