[junkware] CCleaner, Defraggler, Recuva, Speccy 4in1

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David Pi
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Re: CCleaner, Defraggler, Recuva, Speccy 4in1 Pack Portable

#16 Post by David Pi »

GeddichNixan wrote: I am sorry, but this was by no means an appropriate counterargument. You answered with yet more sarcasm, now we definitely know and are repeatedly reminded that you are annoyed, but that was it. Constructive? Not at all.
I thought this thread is end but it is not, this is good.

As you said, the opposite point of view between you and my countrymen about my website is base on different cultures. The ShanZhai culture became popular since China start openning gates in 1980's. If you look ahead, the communism is ShanZhaied from Russia, isn't it? So it's no doubt most people in China now enjoying ShanZhaiing like a kind of amusement. Every spring festival some Shanzhai comedian came out and imitate some ugly famous Stars on TV, they won't be indicted.

This is sad, and won't last long. As you said, most industry begins from copying. And I don't approve of this (ShanZhai behaviour). So why do I made a website like this?

In my point of view, there're two kind of ShanZhai, the 100% copycat and the copying of the skin. Some ShanZhai factories copied Apple from outside to inside, with no creation. Their products named "lphone" or "lpad", etc. This is the 100% copycat. It's the synonyms for plagiarize ,tort and inferior quality, it has no contribute on promoting human progress. It's worthless and not worth mentioning.

But there's another kind of ShanZhai. As you mentioned Japan, Japanese characters is ShanZhaied from China a long period ago, in 14 century they create kana to spell Chinese characters (like English letters). Nowadays modern Japanese is a mixture of Chinese characters and kana. This is another kind of ShanZhai. Another example is the katana (Japanese samurai sword), which is ShanZhaied from China in Tang dynasty (the late period of the Frankish Empire in Europe), nowadays it became the most famous ancient sword in the world. So this kind of ShanZhai is based on creation. It copied the skin and create a new spirit, it do promoting the human progress.

Back to my copycat site. You have made a common view that this is the most ridiculous copying of portableapps.com. But if you see a site not only copy the domain name, the logo, but all it's content is copied from portableapps.com, what will you think? There's a lots this kind of site on internet. When I change the domain name and the site banner, it will be no any relationship to portableapps.com. All apps in the site is written by me, none of one single code is copied from them (of course I read their codes and learned a lot). The purpose I made it look like ShanZhai goods (in your word, worthless copycat) is to amuse my vistors. First they will think: another ShanZhai site. And then they will found there're a lot of original content. A lot of Chinese apps that PortableApps.com will never made. Big contrast is the source of humorous. This is what I want. As I wrote in the about page([site removed]/about/), this site is ShanZhaiing with creation.

So please don't think "it's black, or it's white". You have been living in a world in good order and perfect law for long time. So you don't understand the grey humourous in a country like mine.

Anyway, thanks a lot. I have learned a lot from you. If your purpose is "let me learn about your point of view", you already did. I hope I can write in Chinese, my English is so bad. That's all.

GeddichNixan
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Re: CCleaner, Defraggler, Recuva, Speccy 4in1 Pack Portable

#17 Post by GeddichNixan »

Now that is more the kind of discussion I like. Exchange is the key word. The chance of learning from and about each other is the key component.

I think we need to distinguish between different kinds of copying. What a comedian does is parody. He imitates someone else that's true but how he does it is something else than copying. He emphasizes some gestures, some behaviors and thus shows the "funny side" of the person he makes his parody of. A good parody is funny and there is no problem with it.

When you copy an item (a piece of electronic device, software or whatever) for your own use , it is not problematic in most cases, because you do not draw profit from that good.

The problems begin when you copy something and you draw profit from it (i.e. you earn money) or you benefit from it in other ways, for example by getting a positive reputation for something that is not the result of your own work. It doesn't matter much whether you copy the "skin" only or the item in question entirely. You draw profit from the work and the reputation of others and you take it for free.

When you use a domain name like yours which has only a very small difference in it's name to that of PortableApps.com you get internet traffic from those, who type your domain instead of PA's by mistake or from those who may think that your site is a kind of dependence of PortableApps.com and so on. Building up PortableApps.com and getting it to the point where it is now took a lot of time and a lot of work. By redirecting internet traffic to your site you simply benefit from that effort although you did not make any contribution. The same applies to software packages you make without asking the author of the original software for permission.

There is yet another problem with copying. In case that visitors of your website think that you are somehow related to the original PA site and their work, what happens when your packages do not work as good as PA's do? Those, who are disappointed by your stuff may get the impression that PA's own packages are similarly bad. That way you may damage PA's reputation.

Even copycats may find copying bad at a certain point of time. One may benefit from it at the beginning by earning money, reputation or by learning from it. Later on, as soon as a copycat develops his own ideas he will be confronted with the next generation of copycats and will become their "victim".

Just a few words to "ridiculous". Many copycats try to hide the connection of their stuff to that of PA and they pretend to distribute software of their own development. In your case the connection to PA is so obvious that you could not deny it. That was what I meant with ridiculous or better that was how I understood as webfork called it so. On the other hand the same thing let me think that you have somehow a slightly different intention than an "ordinary copycat" (whatever that may be), therefore it is worth it to start a discussion.

You could have done it a different way. You could have chosen another domain name like "chinese-portablesoftware.com" or whatever and created the connection to PortableApps.com by simply explaining their work on the website. You could have asked PortableApps.com for permission, or you could have offered your cooperation. In general it is always better to ask in advance. Your request may be refused but that is an option you have to live with. Finally, if you really have original content, than distribute it with your own "brand" without referring to PA the way you are doing it now.

BTW, it is surprising that you know about the Chinese origins of Japanese swords. Many Chinese do not know about it. There is a long list of other Japanese things which came from China (tee, tee ceremony, kimono, traditional hair style, origami, koto (a "Japanese" music instrument) and so on).

I thank you too, it was interesting "meeting" you here. And do not worry about you English, mine isn't that good either.
Last edited by GeddichNixan on Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:40 am, edited 1 time in total.

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MiDoJo
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Re: CCleaner, Defraggler, Recuva, Speccy 4in1 Pack Portable

#18 Post by MiDoJo »

The Higher ups at Piriform have weighed in and I quote
thank you for that. This is indeed against our rules. I dont want to register there so could you please either tell the admin that we want the post removed or give me his e-mail address?
Therefore I have reported this thread as illegal warez

jmsmith
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Re: CCleaner, Defraggler, Recuva, Speccy 4in1 Pack Portable

#19 Post by jmsmith »

Thank for the helpful tools and information about it even if the link has been remove I can still search a website where to download it. I am new from this tools and I'm curious about it looking forward to try this tools.

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webfork
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Re: CCleaner, Defraggler, Recuva, Speccy 4in1 Pack Portable

#20 Post by webfork »

jmsmith wrote:Thank for the helpful tools and information about it even if the link has been remove I can still search a website where to download it. I am new from this tools and I'm curious about it looking forward to try this tools.
As portablefreeware has pretty high google rankings, its important to zap the address itself to avoid essentially advertising for them. That might sound like censorship, but its really quite easy to determine the website location from the current posts.

GeddichNixan
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Re: CCleaner, Defraggler, Recuva, Speccy 4in1 Pack Portable

#21 Post by GeddichNixan »

@webfork
Yes, hints which may help to find the site should be removed. In order to do this, I checked my postings and I did not find anything. (Please correct me if I'm wrong and I will edit my postings accordingly.)

As far as I could see there are some locations in your postings at which the name of the site is mentioned. So you should edit your postings. Everything else is up to the admins. (I.e. postings especially from David Pi)

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Checker
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Re: CCleaner, Defraggler, Recuva, Speccy 4in1 Pack Portable

#22 Post by Checker »

There still is a link here :!:

GeddichNixan
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Re: CCleaner, Defraggler, Recuva, Speccy 4in1 Pack Portable

#23 Post by GeddichNixan »

Thanks Checker. Well, the EYE sees everything. :-D
Although I could not remove the link, but I reread my subsequent posting and found a section which described the domain name. I have modified it. If there is still anything I could change, just post a line.
Last edited by GeddichNixan on Wed Oct 12, 2011 12:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: CCleaner, Defraggler, Recuva, Speccy 4in1 Pack Portable

#24 Post by webfork »

Checker wrote:There still is a link here :!:
Nice catch. I edited that as well as my own Google Translation link to that page.

David Pi
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Re: CCleaner, Defraggler, Recuva, Speccy 4in1 Pack Portable

#25 Post by David Pi »

It seems my link is quite unwelcome here. So I decide to remove the links and keywords by myself (in my posts).

To handle things like this (keywords spread in every posts) is very inconvenience, the censorship system in China can be used for reference. Set sensitive words, all related words would suddenly disappeared. For example, a forum set "Beijing", "Tiananmen Square", "Chairman Mao" as sensitive words. When you post "I love Tiananmen square in Beijing, Chairman Mao shine Tiananmen square everyday." It will become "I love sensitive word in sensitive word, sensitive word shine sensitive word everyday." So easy.

But I'll not stop what I'm doing, except if there is a gun pointed to my head (just a joke, of course). :lol:

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Checker
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Re: CCleaner, Defraggler, Recuva, Speccy 4in1 Pack Portable

#26 Post by Checker »

You should remove this, too :!:
David Pi wrote:But now I got a little confused about the "infringement of portableapps.com format". So how to define the "portableapps.com format"? The launcher and installer is written by me in native NSIS language. Just putting apps in App directory and user data in Data directory, so it's infringement of portableapps.com format. Did portableapps.com regist trademarks of these two directories? I can change the directories' name and call it something else (for example, XXX format), but no one will know what it is. So just for everyone easy to know what it is, I described it as "portableapps.com format". So I have to observe the whole copyright announcement of portableapps.com? Is this true?
Last edited by Checker on Wed Oct 12, 2011 3:23 pm, edited 5 times in total.

GeddichNixan
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Re: CCleaner, Defraggler, Recuva, Speccy 4in1 Pack Portable

#27 Post by GeddichNixan »

@David Pi
Now that was not very funny. As you can see, neither has this forum an automated censorship system, nor do we have the intention to install anything like that. (Please correct me guys if I'm wrong. I hope I ain't! :-D) Teaching us the Chinese methods is thus unnecessary.

What this forum definitely has is it's good reputation and it's rules (written or unwritten) which every user respects and which every potential user has to respect. One of these rules is (as I understand it) that we do not want to provide a platform for software which obviously does not comply with regulations for the protection of intellectual property. Or more simply: No platform for copycats or warez.

We can freely discuss each aspect of portable software even the illegal aspects (as long as a discussion of that kind does not break our own rules), but no one should expect from us to endorse copyright infringements in any form. Exactly this is the essential part of this forum's reputation.

What you do or you don't is entirely your business and the matter of your own understanding of what is right and what is wrong.

Oh, BTW, your link is not welcome here. That's true.

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Re: CCleaner, Defraggler, Recuva, Speccy 4in1 Pack Portable

#28 Post by Checker »

@ webfork: You deleted the links from the original posts of David Pi, but you still have to delete all from yours (or others), where the originals are quoted :!:

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Re: CCleaner, Defraggler, Recuva, Speccy 4in1 Pack Portable

#29 Post by webfork »

Checker wrote:@ webfork: You deleted the links from the original posts of David Pi, but you still have to delete all from yours (or others), where the originals are quoted :!:
You're right -- I missed one (two including your quote).

I'm not sure if you're asking the moderators to do so, but I don't think its necessary to delete any and all references that someone might decipher. I think URL addresses are an advertisement, but I don't see the name of the site as a problem. This is what was done with the "p0rtableappz" situation.

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Re: CCleaner, Defraggler, Recuva, Speccy 4in1 Pack Portable

#30 Post by webfork »

David Pi wrote:To handle things like this (keywords spread in every posts) is very inconvenience, the censorship system in China can be used for reference. Set sensitive words, all related words would suddenly disappeared. For example, a forum set "Beijing", "Tiananmen Square", "Chairman Mao" as sensitive words. When you post "I love Tiananmen square in Beijing, Chairman Mao shine Tiananmen square everyday." It will become "I love sensitive word in sensitive word, sensitive word shine sensitive word everyday." So easy.
You're comparing your painfully counterfeit website to what happens to the Chinese people on a daily basis? So either we allow someone to advertise a website that openly flouts any idea of honesty / fairness or we're similar to a regime that oppresses billions of people? It seems we are not the ones seeing things in black and white now.

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